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The lost art of posting fills...

 
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HollyBerries



Joined: 06 Apr 2002
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2002 11:21 am    Post subject: The lost art of posting fills... Reply with quote

Is it just me, but are some of the newest posters with the newest anime series just plain not doing fills for their posts? Once in a while if one is pounced on by EVERYBODY in the group, after everyone has FINALLY convinced them that there was a problem they MIGHT to a repack/repost, but otherwise it seems like lately people are doing post-and-runs.

Posting PAR files does not completely absolve you of the responsibility to check for and do fills requests when you post! "Use the PARS" is flung around a whole lot, but if you've got seven incomplete parts and only five PARs, what then?

I guess posting this here is kinda preaching to the choir, though, just about everyone here is a more established poster from pre-PAR days who is used to going back and doing fills requests (especially Gorunova, who went waaaay out of his way to do fills on his My Neighbors the Yamadas post Smile ) Still...GRR!

HB
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Gorunova



Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 318
Location: Burnaby, B.C., Canada

PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2002 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heh. I think I probably went overboard with Yamadas, but then all Miyazaki/Ghibli stuff is so good that it's worth a little extra effort to get the word out. Way I figure, that's more people who might end up buying the DVDs.

My pet peeve about the current state of filling in the newsgroups is that fewer people seem to be chipping in to help. Used to be if you requested some parts and the poster or designated fills person no longer had them, at least one or two other people would offer to help out. Maybe it's an illusion caused by the massive increase in posting, but I don't see as much of that now.
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Vulpix



Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2002 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With a decent news server and PARS, I really cannot remember the last time I needed any fills, usenet is a leechers dream nowadays Smile
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(inc)



Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 356
Location: San Diego

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2002 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Part of it is maybe that what comes out of the subbing groups is so inconsistantly posted so much of the time. Responsibility seems to vary so much that, ultimately, for many of the series, no one is taking responsibility. (Just shows you how good hiso is at that... Wink )

Then we have those who say upfront: "No Fills/No Repost...". There have always been a few like that, but they would generally listen to reason. Now the ratio of such posts seems to be higher. Must be nice to have an infallible isp.

(inc)


Last edited by (inc) on Sun Jul 07, 2002 4:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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earthdark



Joined: 21 Feb 2002
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2002 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

heh heh heh
Seems like only yesterday that one could count on a full repost four days after the initial post...
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Keikai



Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 178
Location: Miami, FL

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2002 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After the inception of parchive, I was doing a full repost as well as 20% par set with my posts, but some people felt that was a waste. In truth, I now agree. In fact, I really dont think fills are completely necessary as long as the whole post is verified on servers other than the posting server, preferably major commercial servers, and about 20% parchive files are posted.

That's not to say I'm against fills, at all. I feel it is an act of great generosity. I just don't consider it bad posting behavior to skip them if the above-mentioned steps are taken. It is also very important to let people know your repost intentions when posting (in the 00/part, NFO or subject) so they can make an informed decision regarding your post.

Unfortunately, people also tend to be leaving out the 1% recovery record recently, which I feel is a shame, as it still seems worthwhile.
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HollyBerries



Joined: 06 Apr 2002
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2002 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with no reposts if it comes through complete on SOME servers is that Usenet, being the beast that it is, will always fail for someone somewhere along the line. My news servers (RoadRunner regional) like to take a complete dump about once a month or so for a few days where 80% of what is posted is incomplete in every group. Usually I just sigh and roll my eyes and wait to see if out of the kindness of their heart someone will put up a full repost later. Other issues have come up, though, where the initial poster was convinced that it came through complete just because it was complete on THEIR server when all the parts didn't come through to any of the major servers.

I appreciate that fills are a kindness and not as necessary in this day and age of PARs and recovery records, especially automatic full reposts, but it seems to me to be an eentsy bit lacking in basic posting courtesy to not at least skim the Requests and fill a part here and there for people who aren't so lucky as to have infallible news servers.

HB
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Neuralblastoma



Joined: 19 Feb 2002
Posts: 109
Location: Ottawa Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

People who post through thier ISP's and people who post through premium NSP's should be separated in this argument.

Completion will be much better when posting through a premium NSP.

Posting through one's ISP can of course on occasion, result in a poorly propagated post with not even enough complete parts coming through on premium NSP's. Ev|l Zero's Generator Gawl posts are a prime example.

Still, it's very rare that this happens. A premium NSP will almost always catch enough of a post that propagated poorly to some ISP servers for the PARS to take care of any incompletes.

Rogers(my ISP) is generally very good with completion and has about four to five days retention. However, just like nearly(or every) ISP news-server, it craps out every now and then. And you know what? Tough shit. You have to expect that from ISP news-servers. This is why anyone who does a lot of usenet downloading should have a premium NSP for back-up.

If you can afford an internet connection and a regular supply of CD-R's, then you can afford a few extra dollars for a premium NSP. Easynews is $10 U.S. per month. I'm Canadian so it costs me about $15 with the exchange rate and it's worth every penny.

I've seen some people say they don't have a credit card and therefore can't get an account. I don't know why some people think this, but any premium NSP will let you pay through snail mail with a cheque or money order. Just check thier web sites.

Is $10-$15 such a big deal that this thread was necessary? I'm not a rich guy and don't make much money, but I can afford the above.

Having a premium NSP saves on tonnes of bandwidth, server space and your time. It's much quicker and convenient for you to grab your fills right away than it is to ask for them and hope that someone posts them.

Constant fills and full reposts are a waste of bandwidth.

I've had an Easynews account for a few months now and I love it. Excellent completion and about 40 days retention.

I post though Easynews, use recovery records and post %10-%15 PARS. I think that's sufficient.
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Gorunova



Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 318
Location: Burnaby, B.C., Canada

PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Neuralblastoma wrote:
Is $10-$15 such a big deal that this thread was necessary? I'm not a rich guy and don't make much money, but I can afford the above.


I don't feel it's right to pay that much extra for a service I'm already paying an ISP for. Mind, I probably would go for an NSP account if my ISP's service were really bad, as it occasionally has been in the past. It's pretty good right now, and when there is a burp I'm more inclined to wait for the next repost cycle than to pay for fills, in the absence of regular fills.

Neuralblastoma wrote:
Constant fills and full reposts are a waste of bandwidth.


Definitely. The onus is on the ISPs to do something about it.
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oblio



Joined: 20 Feb 2002
Posts: 106
Location: Detroix, MI

PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2002 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have to say I have huge problems with fills, mostly because of the confusion that comes along with them. Do people need segments or whole files? If they need whole files, and ask for 2, is it because the par's were insufficient, or because they don't know what they are? Did someone 3rd-party-repost them? Maybe reposted them to a group other than where they were originally posted (abmar?).

I get very frustrated at all of this as a would-be 3rd-party reposter. (as a poster, I always handle fills angrily and thuroughly Twisted Evil).

Anyway, my solution has been the fills-ftp, which has its own drawbacks.

Whatever. Smile
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